Columba From Germany, joined Dec 2004, 5100 posts, RR: 3 Posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 10470 times:
I know there are several threads about this topic and it has been discussed to death over the last year but I have just found this article that I wanted to share.
I also wanted to open a new thread for this because the last LH longhaul order thread already had close to 100 replies.
Quote: German flag carrier Lufthansa is considering buying around 15 Boeing 747-8 long-haul jets, a source close to the airline said.
The airline wants to fill a gap in its fleet between the Airbus A340-600 and A380 aircraft.
In September, Lufthansa ordered 35 Airbus aircraft comprising five A319s, ten A320s and 15 A321s with an option over a further 30 aircraft.
Scouseflyer From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2006, 2390 posts, RR: 3 Reply 3, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 10215 times:
Nobody knows what they're going to order so they're being linked with everything (cept the A340).
Columba From Germany, joined Dec 2004, 5100 posts, RR: 3 Reply 4, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 10215 times:
Quoting LTU932 (Reply 2): The article doesn't mention, what has already been mentioned here before, the possibility of an order for the 77W.
A bit surprising IMO.
The article also did not mention the A330 as part of the Airbus order....
LH was evaluating what aircraft is the better choice as a 747-400 replacement for them the 777-300ER or the 747-8I. It seems now more and more that the decison is done in favor for the 747-8I.
If this rumor is true I would also guess that Boeing offered them a good deal to finally get a launch customer.
Regarding the 777 I would not rule out a freighter order but as to now the 747-8F with its nose door might make more sense.
[Edited 2006-11-30 21:28:33]
�Life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans� John Lennon
Jacobin777 From United States, joined Sep 2004, 12734 posts, RR: 57 Reply 5, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 10095 times:
Quoting Columba (Reply 4): The article also did not mention the A330 as part of the Airbus order....
LH was evaluating what aircraft is the better choice as a 747-400 replacement for them the 777-300ER or the 747-8I. It seems now more and more that the decison is done now in favor for the 747-8I.
If this rumor is true I would also guess that Boeing offered them a good deal to finally get a launch customer.
Regarding the 777 I would not rule out a freighter order but as to now the 747-8F with its nose door ability might make more sense.
A few carriers have gone with the 773-ER instead of the 748I because they didn't need the extra capacity. The 773-ER has lower trip costs than the 744, and decreasing some seats should in theory increase yields.
LH's situation is different..judging from what they are stating, they need a plane which fill in the gap between their A346's and A380's....the 773-ER wouldn't do the trick....
I don't see them going with any 773-ER..maybe some 777F's......
LTU932 From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 11023 posts, RR: 45 Reply 6, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 10075 times:
But why doesn't LH also go with the 77W for expansion? From what I heard, they need more planes, so maybe a combined order of 747-8Is for trunk routes and as gapfiller between the A346 and A380, and an order for 77Ws as partial 74M replacement plus for expansion could be a possibility.
Zu fettigem Käse und kalorienreicher Kunstmarmelade, nehme ich einen Doppelkorn.
Heavierthanair From Switzerland, joined Oct 2000, 415 posts, RR: 0 Reply 7, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 9848 times:
G´day
Well, the "News" is from Finanznachrichten, not exactly the most accurate and reliable publication in this world, even less so if aviation is the subject.
I´m not saying LH is not considering to buy 747-8´s, the choice of suitable freighter aircraft is rather limited. If outsize freight is of importance, the 747-8 is just about the only choice, for other freight and to supplement the MD 11 freighters the B 777 and A 380 freighters may offer better economics. With the former being similar in size to the MD 11 who still have years of life left before they need replacement something larger may be desirable. Not to forget politics/negotiation tactics, some orders HAVE to go to Boeing. With the A 320 series for narrowbodies certainly and the A 350 for mid size long range likely to be the mainstay of the future fleet, not much is left for the B company. So guess!
Cheers
Peter
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe." (Albert Einstein, 1879
Columba From Germany, joined Dec 2004, 5100 posts, RR: 3 Reply 10, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 9502 times:
Quoting NYC777 (Reply 8): No word on the 787 either though it has been rumored that the 787 is favored.
No word on the A350 either as the decision whether they order the 787 or the A350 is postponed. Also keep in mind that this article is no official announcement and we will likely hear more about the up-coming fleet renewal plans when LH is officially announcing this order - if it is actually going to happen.
�Life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans� John Lennon
NYC777 From United States, joined Jun 2004, 4155 posts, RR: 25 Reply 11, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 9400 times:
Quoting Columba (Reply 10): No word on the A350 either as the decision whether they order the 787 or the A350 is postponed. Also keep in mind that this article is no official announcement and we will likely hear more about the up-coming fleet renewal plans when LH is officially announcing this order - if it is actually going to happen.
Well if Airbus does launch the A350 tomorrow, as had been rumored, then the A350 vs 787 contest might be decided at LH fairly quickly. I would think that LH already has a lot of the technical and pricing details from Boeing and probably the same from Airbus at this point.
Stitch From United States, joined Jul 2005, 12622 posts, RR: 53 Reply 12, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 9313 times:
As Jacobin777 noted in Reply 5, LH already has a "77W" class airframe in the A346. No, it's not as efficient, but it's not junk, either. And with such a large fleet, LH may very well feel that adding on 748I's would be prudent as it would allow them maximum flexibility to service destinations year-round: A388/748 for the "high season" and A346 for the "low season". So when the Northern Hemisphere traffic is light due to winter, send the A388/748 "down south" and use A346s. Reverse for when the Northern Hemisphere traffic is heavy due to summer.
Quoting LTU932 (Reply 6): But why doesn't LH also go with the 77W for expansion? From what I heard, they need more planes, so maybe a combined order of 747-8Is for trunk routes and as gap-filler between the A346 and A380, and an order for 77Ws as partial 74M replacement plus for expansion could be a possibility.
I really think LH feels the A346 is "good enough" to hold them over until the A350XWB-1000 or Y3 (or an improved 77W) can enter service.
If you are referring to reply 13 in that thread, I believe PanAm_DC10 is talking about converting orders for 748i's to 748f's and visa versa after they've been ordered in case the airlines needs has changed.
Stitch From United States, joined Jul 2005, 12622 posts, RR: 53 Reply 14, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 9096 times:
Quoting Brendows (Reply 13): If you are referring to reply 13 in that thread, I believe PanAm_DC10 is talking about converting orders for 748i's to 748f's and visa versa after they've been ordered in case the airlines needs has changed.
True. I was actually the one who proposed flying 748I's for a bit then converting them to 748F's later in reply. Been a long week up here in the Pacific Northwest.
Zvezda From Lithuania, joined Aug 2004, 9660 posts, RR: 60 Reply 16, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 9021 times:
Quoting Supa7E7 (Reply 15): The quadness of the 748 is exceptional.
??? I would have thought the quadness (is that a malpropism?) of the B747-8 is exactly the same as that of other quads and therefore absolutely unexceptional. What am I missing?
FlyDreamliner From United States, joined Jan 2006, 2358 posts, RR: 11 Reply 18, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 8732 times:
Quoting Solnabo (Reply 17): 748i between 346 (EK:773ER) and 388.
That statement just made my day.
LH´s statement sounds exacly like CEO of EK said earlier this year.
I think that was Boeing's hope, Airbus built the niche high capacity A380, they hoped to build a niche 748 to fill the space between the large single deckers (A346/773ER) and the A380, instead of head to head. Personally, I would sooner see 2 772/A343s go instead of 1 A380, or 2 787/767/A332s go instead of 1 748 and have more frequencies, but that's just me.
"Let the world change you, and you can change the world"
United Airline From Hong Kong SAR, PRC, joined Jan 2001, 7157 posts, RR: 16 Reply 20, posted (1 year 11 months 3 weeks 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 8333 times:
Good news indeed. I also believe that they will go for the B 747-8 to replace their B 747-400s as planned. Hopefully they will get more than 15 eventually and will include options
The B 747-400/747-8 have lower seat mile cost than the B 777.
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